Some people believe in God, and outwardly, they seem to follow Him. But deep down in their hearts, have they ever reflected on the path they have taken and the price they have paid? Have they examined and sought to see whether they have fulfilled the duties entrusted to them by God? What exactly is people’s attitude in their treatment of God? Judging from the various things people exhibit and reveal and even their innermost scheming, not to mention all the dispositions revealed in these things they do in treating God, what have people done for God? Apart from paying a price for and thoroughly considering things beneficial to themselves, what are people’s attitudes toward God, and what do they offer Him? Nothing but scheming, calculating, guarding, and a disdainful attitude. Disdain is an attitude, and what is the behavior that arises from this attitude, if expressed as a verb? “To ridicule.” Have you ever heard of this word? (We have.) “Ridicule” is a somewhat formal term. What do we say in colloquial speech? We say “to tease,” “to play tricks on someone,” “to kid around with someone.” You look unassuming to them, you seem guileless; in their eyes you are nothing and they dare to openly ridicule you—what kind of disposition is this? For someone with a disposition such as this, is it an angel that dwells in their heart, or a demon? (A demon.) It is a demon. If they can treat God like this, then what are they really? Can they practice God’s words? Can they submit to God’s words? Someone such as the man who sent Me gifts, for instance—he does not seek the truth, nor does he understand God’s intentions. He has not the slightest idea of what God requires of man, what God wants to see, or what God wants to gain from man. He’s just like someone interacting with his boss, focusing on how to fawn on and deceive them, treating them however allows him to achieve his goals—what does such a person really live by? He lives by bootlicking, eking out a contemptible life by fawning on his leaders. Why did he offer Me such “caring” and “kindness”? He couldn’t help himself, could he? Could he have predicted how I would have felt about this? (No.) That is right; he did not understand. He entirely lacks a normal human mind. He neither knew nor cared how I might perceive, define, or evaluate his behavior and disposition. What does he care about? He cares about how to fawn on Me to achieve his goals and then leave Me with a good impression of him. That is his intention when going about things. What kind of humanity is this? Is this what a person of true conscience and reason would do? You have lived for so many years, so you ought to understand: First, I do not need your fawning. Second, I do not need you to present Me with anything. Third, and most importantly, you should understand that no matter what you do, no matter what your intentions and goals are, and what the nature of what you do is, I define and reach a conclusion on all of these. It’s not a matter of you doing something and then it’s over; on the contrary, I have to see clearly what your intentions and motives are. I only look at your disposition. Some will probably say, “You are so harsh on people!” Am I? I do not think so at all. It is because I am not at all harsh that some people try to exploit the situation. Is that not how it is? As soon as some people come into contact with Me, they ponder, “I see you as just a regular person. There’s no need to take much notice of you. You’re pretty much just like me: You also eat three meals a day, and I don’t see that you have any authority or power. You’ll have nothing to say no matter how I treat you. What can you do to me?” What manner of thinking is this? Where does it come from? It comes from one’s disposition. Why do people have such a disposition? It is because there are demons dwelling in their hearts. With demons dwelling in their hearts, no matter how great they think God is, no matter how noble they think God’s status is, no matter how they believe it is that God expresses the truth to save people, no matter how much they verbally express their gratitude, and no matter how they indicate their willingness to suffer and pay the price, when the time comes to do their duty, the demons will be in charge in their hearts, and it is the demons that get to work. What kind of person, in your view, dares to deceive and ridicule even God? (A demon.) It is a demon; this much is for certain.

In our fellowship earlier, from which dialogue between Satan and God can we see Satan’s disposition? God said, “Satan, from where come you?” What did Satan reply? (“From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it” (Job 1:7).) What kind of talk is that? (Demonic talk.) It’s demonic talk! If Satan treated God as God, it would say, “God has asked me, so I will say where I’ve come from in a well-behaved manner.” Is that not speaking sensibly? (It is.) It is a sentence in line with normal human thinking: a complete sentence, grammatical and immediately understandable. Is that what Satan said? (No.) What did it say? “From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.” Do you understand this sentence? (No.) Even until now, no one understands what it means. So where was Satan coming from? Where was it going to and fro? Where was it coming from, and which way was it going? Are there any conclusive answers to these questions? To this day, those who interpret the Bible have not been able to work out where Satan was really coming from, or how long it had taken for it to arrive before God and speak to Him; none of these things are known. Then how could Satan answer God’s questioning of it with such a tone and in such language? Did God put the question to it with earnestness? (He did.) Then did it answer in a similar fashion? (It did not.) What attitude did it take in answering God? One of ridicule. It is just like when you ask someone, “Where are you from?” and he replies, “Guess.” “I can’t guess.” He knows you cannot guess it, but he makes you guess, anyway. He is just kidding around with you. It is this attitude that is referred to as playing with someone or ridiculing them. He is not sincere, and he does not want you to know; he just wants to play tricks on you and kid around with you. Satan is of precisely such a disposition. I said that some people have demons dwelling in their hearts; isn’t this how they treat God? Going by their outward appearance of running about, doing things, and occasionally enduring some hardship and paying a little price, they would not appear to be such people; they appear to have God in their hearts. But from their attitudes in the way they treat God and the truth, you see that what dwells in their hearts is a demon, and that is all there is to it. They cannot even answer God’s questions directly—they are the kind of people who go round and round in circles like snakes, until you cannot find the answer and cannot make heads or tails of what they’re saying. Just what sort of people are these? Can they be sincere in their treatment of God? With the attitude of contempt and disdain with which they treat God, can such people practice God’s words as the truth? (No.) Why not? Because demons dwell in their hearts. Is that not so? (Yes, they do not treat God as God at all.) That is the wickedness of these people. Their wickedness lies in thinking that God’s integrity, humility, normality, and practicality that they see are not what makes God lovely—but then what are they? They think that these are God’s shortcomings; that they are areas that make people prone to engendering notions; that they are the greatest imperfections in the God they believe in; that they are deficiencies, problems, and faults. How should people like these be regarded? This is the way and the attitude with which they treat God; it is disgraceful to God, but what about to themselves? Do they derive any benefit from it? It is an insult to themselves, as well. Why do I say that? As an ordinary person, if someone casually gave you something to eat, and you took it and ate it like a fool, without a care for the facts of the matter and without even asking what it was all about, wouldn’t that suggest something was missing from your humanity? Is a person who has something missing from their humanity a normal person? No. If the incarnate Christ did not even possess normal humanity of this sort, would He still be worthy of anyone’s belief? He would not. What are the signs of God incarnate’s humanity? His rationality, thinking, and conscience are the most normal. Does He possess the ability to judge? (Yes.) If I didn’t have that, if I were just a scatterbrain with neither common sense nor insight, incapable of thought when events befall Me, could I still be considered a normal human being? That would be defective humanity, not normal humanity. Could such a person be called Christ? When God was incarnated, would He choose such a flesh? (No.) Certainly not. If I heedlessly did that, would such a God, the One known as God incarnate, be worth following? No, and you would be on the wrong path. This is one aspect, from My perspective. On the other hand, from your perspective, if you regard Him as God, as the object of your following, and as His follower you treat Him in this way—then where are you placing yourself? Is that not disgraceful to you? (It is.) If the God you believe in is so unworthy of your respect in your eyes, yet you still believe in Him, then what does that make you? Are you muddleheaded? Are you a confused follower? Would you not be disgracing yourself? (We would.) But if you think He possesses all these aspects of normal humanity, that He is God incarnate, and you do that all the same, are you not disgracing God? Both perspectives are valid. You can see the problem whether you look at it from God’s perspective or from man’s—and the problem here is a serious one! Is that not so? (It is.) From a human perspective, if you consider Him God and then treat Him like this, then you are openly disgracing God. If you think He is not God but a human being, but you still follow Him, then would that not be a contradiction? Would you not be disgracing yourself? Ponder these two aspects; am I right? Is it not so? Why can’t people think of these things? Why do they still act this way? Is it merely because they do not understand the truth? Let us not go into it too deeply; just looking at it from the perspective of caliber, they are mindless cretins. Why do I say they are mindless? What mind am I referring to? It is about thinking. To do something without thinking, without knowing to weigh the pros and cons, without knowing to consider the nature of what you are doing or whether you should do it or not, is to be mindless. What kind of thing has no mind? Animals and beasts have no minds, but humans would consider these things. People might do stupid things in a moment of impulse, but if they do the same stupid things over and over, then they may be characterized as mindless. A mindless person is someone with impaired reason or, colloquially, someone who has a screw loose. But their selfishness is pronounced, and their cunning tricks are not lacking at all, which is why I say that demons dwell in the hearts of people.

Do you all think it is making a mountain out of a molehill to raise the issue of giving gifts to fellowship on? If I had not fellowshipped on it and had just mentioned it casually, would it have had this effect on you, having listened to it? (It would not.) At most, having listened, you would have pondered, “How could this man have done such a thing? I don’t do things like that; there really are all sorts of people out there!” At most, that is what you would have thought. You might have talked about it a bit, and that is all—but would you have such a deep understanding of it? (No.) You would not have such a deep understanding of it. So, what benefits do My words bring you? What truth have you gained? First of all, I have to remind you: Between man and God, what is the best kind of relationship to establish? When someone approaches God, how should they get along with God when they are in close contact with Him? Isn’t it necessary to seek principles for this? (Yes.) Furthermore, having believed in God for so many years, what incidents have occurred in people’s daily lives that are of the same nature as what the man in the story did? Are these questions not worth contemplating? Could someone learn a lesson and say, “God does not tolerate even slight mistakes, so this is desperately serious. We better not approach Him, have close contact with Him, or deal with Him—He is not to be trifled with! If you mess up, He’ll blow the issue out of proportion and you’ll land yourself in serious trouble. I’m certainly not going to give Him anything!”? Is it acceptable to think like this? (No.) Actually, you do not need to worry: We do not get many opportunities for close contact, and we get even fewer moments in which to interact with each other, so this is not a matter you need to worry about. If I do interact with you someday, do not worry; I will tell you a secret. Whether you get along with Me or pray and seek in private, what is the number one secret? Whatever you do, do not match wits with Me; if you have a combative streak, keep your distance from Me. There are some people who speak with great cunning, concocting several schemes in the blink of an eye, and every sentence they utter is laced with impurity; if they speak more, you will not know which words are true and which are false. Such people must never come near Me. When you come into contact with God and interact with Him, what is the number one key thing you should do and the number one key principle you should abide by? Have an honest heart in your treatment of God. Also, learn deference. Deference is not politeness; it is not fawning or currying favor, nor is it ingratiation or bootlicking. So what exactly is it? (It is treating God as God.) Treating God as God is a major principle. What about the particulars? (Learn to listen to God.) That is one aspect of practice. Some people come into contact with Me, and they start talking over Me, so I let them finish before I continue. And how do they treat Me when I am speaking? They listen with their eyes closed. What does this imply? It’s like saying, “What you’re saying is nonsense. What do you know?” That’s their attitude. I may not know everything, but I have principles, and I tell you what I have learned, seen, and can understand, as well as the principles I know, and you can gain quite a lot from it. But if you are always glancing at Me, thinking that I do not know anything, and you do not listen to Me carefully, then you will not gain anything—you will just have to find things out for yourself. Is that not how it is? So, you have to learn to listen to God’s words. When you listen, do I limit you in expressing your views? I do not. Once I have finished speaking, I ask you all if you have any questions, and if anyone does, then I answer it immediately and tell you the principles involved in those questions. Sometimes I do not just tell you the principles, but I tell you directly what you should do, detailing each aspect. Although there are some fields I do not understand, I have My own principles, and I have My own views on and ways of handling such matters, so I am teaching you based on what I think are sound views and principles. Why is it that I am able to teach you? It is because you do not even understand these things. Once these questions have been answered, I will ask again if there are any more questions; if there are, then I will once again answer them without delay. I do not just want you to listen to Me; I give you the opportunity to talk, but what you say has to be reasonable—no nonsense, and no time-wasting. Sometimes, I interrupt some people out of impatience. Under what circumstances? It is when they are long-winded, using ten sentences for what can be said in five. In fact, I understand as soon as I hear them; I know what is coming next, so they do not have to say anything more. Be concise and to the point; don’t waste others’ time. Once you’re finished speaking, I will give you an answer, and tell you what to do and the principles according to which to do it. That should be the end of the matter, should it not? But some people can’t pick up on this, and say, “No, You have to respect me; our respect goes both ways. You’ve finished speaking, but I haven’t finished expressing my point of view. My point of view is this—I have to start from the beginning again.” They always want to express their views in the belief that I am not aware of them, when in fact, as soon as they start talking, I know what their views are—so is there any need for them to continue? There is no need. Some people have such a low IQ that it takes them ten sentences for a matter that only requires two, and unless I cut them off, they will keep on talking. Everyone else has understood; do I still not understand? But still, they want to express themselves, so it is not just that their IQs are low—their reason is weak too! Have you ever encountered such people? (Yes.) They think they are smart even though they have poor reason and a low IQ. Is that not sickening? It is nauseating and sickening. When people come into contact with God, the first thing is to treat Him with an honest heart; the second is that people must learn deference; and the third and most important thing is to learn to seek the truth. Is that not what is most important? (It is.) What is the point of believing in God if you do not seek the truth? What is the value of believing in Him? Where is the sense in it? This point is something that most people may fall short of, so why bring it up? It’s a preparation for the future; you need to learn to practice in this way when these sorts of things happen to you in future.

At church, I came into contact with many people, some of whom I charged with a few things to do. A few days later, they gave Me feedback, showing Me that they noted down everything I assigned, and that they were now in the process of implementing each and every one. When they met Me, they reported to Me about the progress of implementation, what issues required seeking, and which ones were still awaiting results, giving Me a complete update. They explained the details very clearly, and although at times they were a bit trivial, their attitudes showed that they were serious and responsible in their treatment of God’s words, and that they knew what their responsibilities, duties, and obligations were. Some people were different: I charged them with two tasks, and they wrote them down in their notebooks, but a week later, when they still hadn’t implemented anything, they only remembered once I questioned them about it—and then they wrote it all down in their notebooks again. After another week, when I asked them why the matter still had not been wrapped up, they made excuses, citing this difficulty and that difficulty, before diligently committing everything to their notebooks yet again. Where did they commit everything? (To their notebooks.) But they did not commit anything to their minds. Is this not entrusting something to the wrong person? These people are not human. Anything I entrusted them with went in one ear and out the other—they did not take it seriously at all. All the tasks pertaining to a certain profession or to general affairs—along with some matters relating to church work—that I assign people are within the scope of what they can achieve; none are intended to make things difficult for them. However, often when I entrusted leaders and workers to do things, most of them did not report to Me after undertaking the commission, and I didn’t hear anything back about the status of the work. Whether it was arranged, how it was done, what errors occurred, the current results—they never reported back about any of these or engaged in seeking. They just set their commissions aside, and I didn’t even get to hear about any of the outcomes. Some people had an even more serious problem, in that, on top of failing to implement what I assigned to them, they also came to fawn on and deceive Me, telling Me where they went and what they did yesterday, what they did the day before that, and what they were doing now. Look at how good they were at pretending and sophistry—they did none of the things I specifically assigned to them, instead busying themselves with useless tasks while critical work was in complete disarray. What kind of behavior was this? They completely neglected their proper tasks, and they were full of lies and deception!

There was a man in charge of planting. I asked him, “There are some greens that look good this year. Did you save any seeds?” “I did,” he replied. I said, “I heard that they harvested all the greens some time ago and didn’t save any seeds.” He said, “They haven’t finished the harvest. There are still some left over!” I then asked, “Where are the leftover greens? Let Me take a look.” He said, “Oh? Well … let me go and check first.” Did he actually save any seeds, or not? He didn’t. Of these few words he spoke, was his first statement of “I did” a lie? (Yes.) And his second statement, “They haven’t finished the harvest. There are still some left over!”—was that not a lie? He did not know whether they had saved any seeds, and said, “Let me go and check first.” So the third statement was yet another lie. The lies got more serious from statement to statement; he was layering lie upon lie, progressively getting deeper and deeper—a mouth full of lies! Would you all be willing to interact with someone whose mouth is full of lies? (No.) How do you feel when talking to and working with people who are full of lies? Do you get angry? He had the gall to deceive anyone; he was wrong if he thought I didn’t know! Can the matter be worth the deceit? What did he stand to gain by being so deceitful? If you saw this attitude in how he acts, if he treated you this way, how would you feel? If basically 99 percent of what a person says is a lie, no matter whether they are gossiping or talking about work or serious matters, or fellowshipping on the truth, then this person is beyond hope. He can deceive anyone; what does that make him? How long has he believed in God? Some nonbelievers are always saying, “As far as I know,” or, “Speaking from the heart,” and with that premise, they are saying something truthful. That man believed in God for so many years, and he listened to so many sermons, but he could not even speak a word of truth; everything he said was a lie. What kind of creature is he, then? Is it not sickening and abhorrent? Are there many people like this? Are you like this? When you interact with Me, under what circumstances would you lie to Me? If you have caused some disaster, and you know that the consequences are serious and that you can be expelled, then as soon as others mention it, you lie to cover it up. Anyone can lie about that sort of thing. What else can people lie about? Lying to boost their image and be held in high regard by others. Then there are those who know that they are incompetent at their work, but they do not tell the Above explicitly, for fear that they will be dismissed if they do. When reporting their work to the Above, they pretend to seek ways to fix the problem, giving others a false impression. Everything they say is a lie, and they are fundamentally incapable of doing work. If they do not ask some questions, they fear that the Above will spot the discrepancies and replace them, so they hastily put on a pretense. This is what the mentality of false leaders and antichrists is like.

Contemplate the three principles of interacting with God that I have just fellowshipped on. Which one can you not do, and which one is easy for you to achieve? In fact, it is not easy to truly implement any of them, because demons dwell in the hearts of people. You will not be able to achieve them before you have cast the demon out of your heart. You have to battle the demon in your heart, and if you can overcome it every time, then you can achieve them. If every time you fail and are captured by it, then you won’t be able to accomplish them; you won’t be able to implement any of the principles. If you can accomplish all three, not only when getting along or interacting with Me, but also in your regular interactions with the brothers and sisters, following these principles, won’t everyone benefit from this? (Yes.) Now that the story is over, let’s move on to the main topic.